Managed or un-managed POE Switch.....??

JanJ

At present, I have 2 main switches: One POE, for security cameras and ‘Bogus Gateway’ (gateway just for cameras, so they can’t get to internet) – and other GB switch for all others… I externally monitor cameras via an app on NAS….

The 16 port POE switch: GOALAKE (Don’t Bother!!) can’t seem to handle a full load, be it POE or not POE…. I have reduced the POE loading to 7, non POE connections to 2… (Total connections=9) to get around this limitation, which fixed the issue, but forced me to bring out of retirement the very POE switch I was trying to retire to get all POE’s items operational! GRRRR! So a new POE Switch will be purchased later this year: (16 port POE switch: tp-link TL-SG1218MP V5, if un-managed)

As mentioned above, I don’t have managed switches…. (And Packet Sniffer custom rules prevent me from changing IP of security cameras, so VLAN is not presently viable here – another reason for the ’Bogus Gateway just for cameras)….

If my plans don’t now need a Managed POE switch, but I see the $$ Difference is $40-60 for a managed switch….
Though I’m not presently needing the configuration power of a managed switch now…. Should I still consider purchasing a managed POE switch, in case my needs change in future?
Could it be configured to act as if it was un-managed for now?
Again, Have Firewall(s) in Router and NAS’s; Packet sniffer in Router with many custom IP based rules… and security cameras have gateway entered that exists, but has no WAN/Internet connection (This also minimizes the “Where is?” communications on LAN.)…

I’m self taught….. What would you do? Thanks for your suggestions…

vabello

What do you mean by “can’t seem to handle”? PoE switches have a maximum wattage for which they are rated. Are you exceeding that? From a bandwidth perspective, I don’t think I’ve encountered a modern switch that can’t handle the aggregate bandwidth of all the ports combined. It might just be bad or junk.

I’m confused by your bogus gateway setup. If the cameras don’t need to talk to anything outside the local network, just don’t configure a gateway on them. If you have to configure one because the device forces you to, just set it to a non-existent IP on the LAN. I’m also unclear what the role of a packet sniffer is in your setup where rules prevent you from renumbering the cameras.

For managed vs unmanaged, I always choose managed, but my primary job role was a network engineer for almost two decades. The bottom line is if you’ll bother using any of the features in a managed switch or not. If you don’t configure anything, it will still work similar to an unmanaged switch, but you may have to watch what the default spanning-tree configuration is on the switch. Managed switches almost always run spanning-tree which is designed to prevent network loops. Often times without configuration, a port may default to a non-edge port role (although smaller switches may be the opposite). Non-edge ports will often stay in a listening state for BPDUs from other switches before moving to a forwarding state. This delays devices from connecting to
The network after the interface gets link.

Do you find value in features like VLANs, spanning-tree, DHCP/RA snooping, IGMP/MLD snooping, flood controls, port mirroring, port configuration for speed/duplex, manual MTU configuration, QoS, SNMP, LAG/LACP, and firmware updates? If you’ll never be bothered with anything like that, will likely only ever have a very simple layer 2 topology, and don’t want to be bothered with spanning-tree, just get an unmanaged switch.

JanJ

vabello
Thank you. Saved me some $ later on this year!
The more devices I added over 13, of any type caused existing cameras to be intermittent, or didn’t view correctly from the NAS programs (multiple). Adding the prior POE SWITCH 8 ports 4POE & 3x power inserters for 3x cameras in non POE Ports, with 8th being an uplink (This is the POE Switch I was trying to retire), and reducing ports used on GOALAKE got system fully operational again. I’ve tried a couple times adding more non POE or POE devices since then and either cause random GOALAKE camera degradation in connections to NAS, but not other POE Switch cameras. Also Moved cameras between switches. It’s not cables , cameras, or apparently POE Power. It’s As if GOALAKE can’t pass all that data.
The unit I’m looking at has POE overpower indicator, that GOALAKE doesn’t have though tests seem to indicate issue is not POE Power

stxrmful

sounds like you have the same/similar setup I do.

I have a Dell X1018P-16 gigabit PoE switch (long af) that has 8 ports configured on VLAN 1 which is my main network, and the other 8 ports configured on VLAN 3 for all my camera stuff. Two different routers on each VLAN as well makes it easier to configure the network. On the camera VLAN i’m using a NETGEAR R6300v2 as an AP/router with no internet connectivity. Two PCs, two NICs each, between the two PCs they run Orchid Fusion VMS and two Orchid Recorders for 6 cameras (“trial” version lets you configure four cameras hence two PCs because i’m not paying for the license it’s too expensive and I like this software. I’ve tried blue iris, zoneminder, shinobi, this one just works) mixture of two ONVIF energizer walmart specials, an ONVIF hikvision, some random RTSP no-name PTZ, an RTSP alarm.com camera, and a RTSP TMEZON NVR for my analog cameras. acts as a network encoder. no hard drive on the nvr just connects to orchid and orchid records. there’s no internet on that side.

The X1018P-16 has a slow, shitty UI in my opinion, but it does the job and it does it well. The fans are also a bit more irritating than i’d like, but hey I can pretend I have a datacenter in my den. I even have two SFP ports if I decide to add fiber into my network in the future. I don’t think that’ll ever happen, but it is a possibility. I have connected 16 access points to this switch at one point, it was pulling A LOT of power but it kept up, no issue whatsoever.

There are two different variants of the X1018 switch, non-PoE and PoE.

Dell X1018-16 non-PoE version: https://www.ebay.com/itm/267237521843?_skw=dell+x1018p-16&itmmeta=01JY4SH0TD8HSCF3ZFFGEPSH4Z&hash=item3e3898f9b3:g:wMsAAOSwAJZlMA5n&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1ciPqnTlA0raMG3vIiZDMSMSei4ocZn01FacJyDRdyDIUSPbPmk3Ype4rSeCeSGp8cme%2FT1Fpq5OQCICd7zvUP7Ek%2F8YcOHydPvtFsA%2FUPHm2rvwBNpQ88F9qwn1kebvyrRFLW2BQ8ojK5uAn7dfCdQTCnJ6K2z%2BMI8acn%2Fbvo7fGgR2X3OJ8jbvl6MiVlUvE8ZwMocNPIGd9GpUzCOPdFKcYcpD%2B--Jh15FtbQ%2FOSxQSIDwE05rZEDLMmfz%2BKs5NfJEzN8oRt6xvnSVBXO8V9g7uXOcvdJgoN9a7i3bNwaIg%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABFBMsI3EmfFl

Dell X1018P-16 PoE version: https://www.ebay.com/itm/267237521843?_skw=dell+x1018p-16&itmmeta=01JY4SH0TD8HSCF3ZFFGEPSH4Z&hash=item3e3898f9b3:g:wMsAAOSwAJZlMA5n&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1ciPqnTlA0raMG3vIiZDMSMSei4ocZn01FacJyDRdyDIUSPbPmk3Ype4rSeCeSGp8cme%2FT1Fpq5OQCICd7zvUP7Ek%2F8YcOHydPvtFsA%2FUPHm2rvwBNpQ88F9qwn1kebvyrRFLW2BQ8ojK5uAn7dfCdQTCnJ6K2z%2BMI8acn%2Fbvo7fGgR2X3OJ8jbvl6MiVlUvE8ZwMocNPIGd9GpUzCOPdFKcYcpD%2B--Jh15FtbQ%2FOSxQSIDwE05rZEDLMmfz%2BKs5NfJEzN8oRt6xvnSVBXO8V9g7uXOcvdJgoN9a7i3bNwaIg%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABFBMsI3EmfFl

stxrmful

JanJ

I’m using Surveillance Station from Synology on 3x NAS’s.
13 cams: 8x obsolete Hikvision 2K, & 5x ONVIF 4K cams from Ali Express, of 2x different 4K MFG’s (1 of 2 MFG’s =Unknown). Because of obsolete firmware on Hikvision, and ALI Express cams; the “Bogus Gateway”.

stxrmful

my ptz cam unfortunately is locked to P2P so I can’t use it on my camera LAN which is weird. It HAS to be connected to the internet to work. There’s a workaround for some that work and some that don’t and that one falls under the one that it doesn’t work. It also doesn’t work well with my Dell X1018P-16 switch for whatever reason. I have to connect it through a TP-Link PoE switch. I plan on replacing that one as soon as I can.

I have heard of and want to try surveillance station at some point if I ever get my hands on a synology NAS. I use Windows Server 2019 and two 1TB HDD for a “nas” solution (with other things it does)

JanJ

I’m doing a 180 degree turn around.
After a great phone call with TP Link Support as pre-sales…. Regarding this subject: He spent some time with me describing the benefits of a managed switch for port & POE Monitoring - that was made clear to me, using my own recent symptoms!
I made notes in printout of user manual as he spoke, and realized Had I had the same features in GOALAKE, I would already KNOW if its network or POE!
Live & Learn: Always cheapest to go first class!
Seeing that I’ll be needing 14 ports, it’s just better off going with a 24 port over 16, also.
That means it’s a TL-SG1428PE.
November timeframe.

HardlyWorthit

JanJ
Be sure to pay attention to POE power budget.
Have fun

JanJ

HardlyWorthit
It was pointed out by support that monitoring has both total & individual power levels that are currently being seen. He pointed out areas as I found them in manual, as I don’t have it yet.
That was one of selling points (being able to see network health and POS Power) that made me realize a managed switch was worth the expense even if none of the major options might be used. Old dog learning new tricks!

JanJ

Ordered it! TL-SG1428PE managed POE Switch. Found on sale - new in box. V3.6 hardware…
Thanks for suggestions
PS: I have heard this has 2 loud fans, so I browsed for info on mods, but found an error in the posts: replacement fan types touted in posts are not only the wrong type, they are quieter due to they provide less CFM! No wonder many posts indicate switch dies a year or so after ‘modding’- You reduced the cooling on something running 24/7/365!!!! It’s going in a rack in a closet. Fans will remain stock.

JanJ

New switch arrived!
Seller said it is hardware v3.6
Box says 3.6
Label on unit says 3.6

BUT LOGIN TO IT: V3.0!!!

JanJ

Needless to say. Sent back! CC Company now involved!

So I guess it’s hard drives and hardware being scammed now!

Dick

JanJ , have a look at this KB.

The downloads for both the 3.6 and 3.0 HW versions have the same firmware binary (TL-SG1428PE(UN) 3.0_1.0.0 Build 20230619).

JanJ

TP-Link Support says this serial number is V3.0, and was manufactured in early 2022!

BE AWARE OF SCAMS LIKE THIS!

bighorn1

How much did you pay and who’s the seller?

On sale on Amazon (ships from Amazon and sold by Amazon) for $195.

JanJ

Bighorn: I bit less than $195 Delivered…. Ebay seller with 95+% good rating…

I didn’t go Amazon because I was told (AGAIN TP-LINK Presales Phone Support): to ONLY PURCHASE A V3.6 UNIT , and Amazon does not allow you to ask questions of seller - Pre-Sales…. Ebay does, and seller said it was 3.6! (Yes! BOX & Unit says V3.6, but firmware says 3.0)!

Dick: I saw that, but it is vague, and doesn’t cover TL-SG1428PE, and based on PreSales Phone support I had regarding this exact model… I believe I had a direction from TP Link that Switch “must be V3.6” and why I contacted seller specifying 3.6 before the sale! OH YES: this exact unit is not Omada compatible… I know that and I’m ok with it…

So you’re saying 3.6 and 3.0 are the same? Firmware for both 3.6 and 3.0 are at different locations at download site with different date So ????????????

And if so….
Why didn’t TP-Link Phone support know this? But Instead: Gave him same serial number and he said it’s early 2022 MFG, and 2022 Code, but he Suggested I: “Send it back and get a current model” ???

Or, should I be looking for a different model or MFG altogether? (the minimal Managed options this gives are fine)…
I’m wanting a 28 Port GB Managed POE Switch…. The reduced configurations of the TL-SG1428PE are sufficient for my needs….
If unit was sent back to be modified to V3.6, why not update the firmware? One and not other? With no notes for the eventual end-user?
All I can do is keep referring to the 2 calls I had with TP-Link Phone Support….. THEY SHOULD KNOW, RIGHT???
This appears to be more complex that it needs to be…. a note with unit or posting at their website should de-mystify all this…. But doesn’t! ?????

If I ever get a V3.6 unit….. The fans, which people are saying are way too loud – Are not bad at all, and the threads showing Fan replacement are in error… Quieter because less CFM - That’ll cook components! (Going in rack in closet –IF I ever get one!).

Dick

JanJ So you’re saying 3.6 and 3.0 are the same? Firmware for both 3.6 and 3.0 are at different locations at download site with different date So ????????????

Most likely the date posted, not the firmware date. I downloaded both; they are identical files:
TL-SG1428PE(UN) 3.0_1.0.0 Build 20230619.zip. Anyway, if you hover over the link you will see there is only one file.
By the way, that KB is referenced in the TP-Link forum in a post about the TL-SG1428PE. So yes, HW 3.0 and 3.6 are the same. You can look at other TP-Link managed switches firmware download pages and you’ll see the same thing. That last digit is not a revision number, it indicates the factory as stated in the KB.

JanJ

Dick
Thank you, Dick!
I just got off phone with Neil from TP-Link Support:
About 2022 TP LINK started referring - internally - to a HARDWARE version, and a FIRMWARE Version for this product. That has never been released to the Public, or indicated in ANY of their manuals, or labels on the units, and obviously as described below, they didn’t update their Software Status screen either!!!.
In the case of the TL-SG1428PE:
The present version of this product is: Hardware V3.6. With Firmware version 3.0 installed.

The Label on box and Unit only indicates Hardware Version, not Firmware Version –Though Firmware Status Screen when you login to the unit reflects the FIRMWARE VERSION INSTALLED – But displays the FIRMWARE VERSION AS: HARDWARE VERSION!!!!
THAT IS AS CLEAR AS MUD!.

I then asked: so if firmware on received unit is 2022 version…… What firmware download should be used? You’re website specifies that you pre-select firmware based on hardware version installed , and now your telling me 3.0 is for both 3.0 & 3.6 - So: WHICH????

Either one- they are same!

I pointed out this is confusing and website download areas is covered with many: BEWARE Warnings not to load wrong version!!! I’m just trying to cover my ass! The Firmware Status Screen reporting FIRMWARE as HARDWARE Version doesn’t help, either!
He agrees it is confusing for those who don’t have background with how company thinks. !!??!!

Consider me somewhat trained in the TP-Link way of thinking!!

3.0 & 3.6 Hardware both use 3.0 Firmware, Label indicates only Hardware version, and Firmware Status Screen displays FIRMWARE as HARDWARE Version! You can apparently load latest firmware from either 3.0 or 3.6 download areas. Still need to order one (upcoming issues post-phoning this upgrade till September) !