Are Solar Panels Systems Worth It?

telcodad

Every now and then, I get to thinking about having a solar panel system installed on my home.

But then, I see/read about horror stories like below, and it changes my mind.

Also, would it be better to purchase or lease a solar panel system?

Thousands struggling to get solar panels fixed after company’s bankruptcy. How the new CEO is trying to help
By Mahsa Saeidi & Walter Smith Randolph, CBS New York - May 13, 2025
https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/sunpower-bankruptcy-solar-panel-broken/

Maria and Louis Pinneri’s golden years have been shaded by a broken solar panel system.

In 2011, the Staten Island couple leased it through SunPower, a giant in the industry. In March 2023, they say it broke – specifically, the inverter, which converts electricity generated by the sun into electricity appropriate for the grid.

“And they told us as soon as we get the new meter, we’re going to replace it,” Louis Pinneri said. “And I never heard it from them again.” ….
:
Rodgers says in recent months, dozens of small to mid-size solar installers, contractors and companies have failed.

“It is an industry that has pretty much collapsed,” he said. “And the other problem, I’ll just tell you, is the government … ’Oh, we can’t do it because we can’t get this vote through. Oh, we’re going to pay for a part of your system, we’re not going to pay for part of your system.' And those jerk-arounds take a toll.”

real_aurgathor

telcodad

Solar panels save families an average of $2,000 a year, according to a new study

The new study examined roughly 500,000 U.S. households that adopted rooftop solar. It found that the median energy burden fell from 3.3 percent to 2.6 percent across adopters.

The authors put it plainly, “rooftop solar reduces energy burden across a majority of adopters during our study period from a median of 3.3% to 2.6%,” wrote Forrester. That is a national view, not a single city snapshot.

News: https://www.earth.com/news/solar-panels-save-families-an-average-of-nearly-2000-a-year-new-study/

Study: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-024-48967-x

pandaman1784

i bought my solar panel system in Nov 2019 and started making power in Feb 2020. After all the rebates paid out over 4 years, my system is currently printing money every time the sun is shining.

there’s really not much you can do about companies going bankrupt. the best you can do is to pick an installer that uses a major equipment manufacturer. All of my inverter equipment are from Enphase. I don’t see them going out of business any time soon since they are a market leader. the problem with SunPower is twofold. first, NEVER lease your solar panels. you either buy them outright or you finance them. you have no control over the equipment if you lease. second, SunPower decided to be fancy and create their on proprietary system. as such, when they fail, only SunPower can resolve the issue. i have none of those problems. i own all of my equipment, so i can replace the parts as I please. my parts are standard Enphase configuration. as as long as Enphase is in business, my equipment will work.

telcodad

pandaman1784 i bought my solar panel system in Nov 2019 and started making power in Feb 2020. After all the rebates paid out over 4 years, my system is currently printing money every time the sun is shining.

Thanks for that input. But are things changing now for the worse?

Does the current tariffs situation make some parts significantly more expensive now?

Will the government tax credits and rebates be going away soon?

Tax Credits for EVs and Solar Panels Would End Under House Republicans’ Plan
The credits would stay around for 2025 but expire at the end of the year if the proposal becomes law.
https://www.cnet.com/home/energy-and-utilities/tax-credits-for-evs-solar-panels-would-end-under-house-republicans-plan/

Will the credit for selling power back to the local utility be decreased?

Dominion proposes cuts to credit for homes’ solar panels
By Kyle Scott, Richmond Times-Dispatch - May 14, 2025
https://richmond.com/news/state-regional/government-politics/article_61c81e8e-4724-424a-b0bf-746465b9e707.html

Dominion Energy wants to cut the credit that customers with solar panels on their rooftops can get on their monthly power bills, a move that could make installing them less attractive to homeowners and businesses.

Dominion currently values electricity flowing from residential rooftop solar panels at about 14 cents per kilowatt hour. The company proposes dropping this credit to 9.553 cents per kilowatt hour, the rate the utility pays for solar power from large-scale facilities. It’s a change Dominion says means a fairer deal for customers who don’t have their own solar panels.

Somewhat-Reticent

pandaman1784 my parts are standard Enphase configuration

Is that just as proprietary as SunPower’s ?

pandaman1784

telcodad

that’s hard to say. solar companies should still have existing stock of equipment. but if the tariffs drag on, then yea, everything will get more expensive. almost all solar panels come from China. most of the control parts are manufactured in China.

if you get it put in this year, then you should get the money back in your 2025 taxes. so if you’re worried about it going away, now is the time to get it.

as for your utility, that’s a case by case basis. every state is different. in NY, net metering is required by the state. so utilities have no choice.

Sparkchaser

telcodad Thanks for that input. But are things changing now for the worse?

I think we missed the best time. My former boss, a PhD physicist, started in the late 80’s and into the 90’s. Started with just a solar hot water heater and when his utility started offering rebates, buy power back, etc., he went solar electric. Did very well in $$ savings.

This is in PA about 50 mi west of Philly.

telcodad

pandaman1784 almost all solar panels come from China. most of the control parts are manufactured in China.

And just saw this item in the Security forum now - Jeez!

https://broadbandbulletin.com/d/3071-rogue-communication-devices-found-in-chinese-solar-inverters

r81984

I dont think it is worth it through any of these “finance” solar companies and if your area does not have any real buy back.
In texas, every house for sale with solar will not sell unless the owner fully pays off the panels or the house will sell for $100K less than market. Solar panel houses just sit on the market for a year or more as the price keeps dropping.
Then in Texas, you dont even save money with solar vs grid power costs when it comes to the “finance” solar companies.

I think the only way to save money is to install your own system and not use a “finance” company middle man with a 40 year loan. If you need financing then get that on your own and buy a system not part a finance company. Be careful what deal you sign for panels and quote out several companies. If you ever plan on selling then I would not put panels up at all.

pandaman1784

Somewhat-Reticent

no, sunpower took standard equipment and added another layer of complexity to it.

but yes, if enphase does out of business, then i’m SOL. but if you want grid tie in for netmetering, you have to use commercially available equipment. you can’t just hobble something together and connect to the grid.

geek

Many questions to answer to determine if it’s worth it-

Goals?
Time period?
Budget?

I’m thinking of doing things more as a hobby and seeing how that goes before going whole hog.

My goals are:

120v - Backup power for fridge, comms, gas furnace. 3 days (if traveling, I don’t want to come back to spoiled food or frozen pipes, etc.) 150W x 36h = 5400 Wh
240v for the well? (optional). I would like to run all of #1 plus the well and most other 120V circuits for 8 hours or so before the system needs a recharge….say from a propane/gas generator (which is my current backup solution).
Solar generation - Slowly add panels to see if we can take #1 off grid and maybe most of #2 off grid. At that point we’d really need grid power for A/C, dryer and stove and of course if there is a period of low output solar.
Portability - I like things I can take with me or sell easily. Fortunately, I also have room in the yard to setup the panels. No need to attach to the roof or house or anything like that. No insurance issues to deal with.

I’m seriously looking at this setup. But man, the Chinese thing scares me. Essentially, it’s a crap shoot.

https://www.pecron.com/products/pecron-e3600lfp-portable-power-station-3600w-3072wh?variant=44149259927740

and then two extra batteries

https://www.pecron.com/products/pecron-ep3000-expansion-battery-3072wh

That’s about $4516 without any panels. I can find panels pretty much anywhere and add them later. Maybe another $1500-$2000 in panels? So $6500 total?

Oh and yeah the whole efficiency/math thing is very rough. I think these are 85% efficient. Also thinking about getting a smallish (1500W) 12v inverter so I don’t have the leave the built in 3600W/120v one on.

Somewhat-Reticent

What do you mean when you say “standard” then ? Enphase equipment ?
Do other vendors follow Enphase’s standard ?

pandaman1784

Somewhat-Reticent
there are 2 major equipment manufacturers for solar equipment that’s installed in the US. if the installer wants to use micro-inverters, then Enphase is the most popular. if the installer wants to go with string inverter, then SolarEdge is the most popular. if you combine both companies market share, it’s 90%+.

so it’s not a standard per se. it’s more like an Apple iphone. lots of carriers (tmobile, verizon, att, etc) sell apple iphones. if Apple went out of business, all of those phones will be useless if the apple servers shut down. same thing with Enphase.

cypherstream

Occasionally those guys walk door to door in our neighborhood trying to sell solar. I put a no
Soliciting sign up, and if they don’t see it our see me outside before the sign they can get pushy.

I’m reluctant because the backyard has a lot of tall trees so it’s too shaded IMO for good output. Also this is not our forever home. Someday we need more space. What happens when you go to sell? Sometimes solar can really complicate things.

Our school district paid $30,000 to a company for A QUOTE. Yes boy did that rile up a lot of us taxpayers. They PAID FOR A QUOTE. I’m sorry but if you want to sell me a system I shouldn’t have to pay for a quote for it. And yet at this time no motions been made to spend the $2 million to get it installed. And now with less state funding and a potential 3.75% tax increase, no way would we be for a $2 million dollar system where there’s no telling how many years it will take to pay off or be efficient or fix things when they break, or clean the panels, etc. You can’t tell me in 10 years they will be as efficient as day 1. Or heck in 10 years new stuff may be more efficient than what you install today.

egeezer

cypherstream Our school district paid $30,000 to a company for A QUOTE. Yes boy did that rile up a lot of us taxpayers. They PAID FOR A QUOTE.

It depends on how detailed the district’s quote requirements were. With complex projects, a prospective provider may spend a lot of time and money providing engineering specs and work estimates only to have the client take the specs to someone else and give them the project. The company doing the spec work is out the money they spent doing the quote.

At our local IBM facility years ago we had a company pull that trick. The marketing guys had a team of engineers spend weeks to prepare a detailed data center design quote for the customer without charge or obligation. The company took the specs to a competitor, who got the contract without having to spend a cent on research and design.

Somewhat-Reticent

Long-term investment is risky enough in a stable economy.

real_aurgathor

1) do not lease – those are essentially scams
2) preferably, pay for it in up-front cash, though financing can be an option if the math works out right
3) get enough capacity to partly/mostly cover your own usage, but don’t plan on selling significant, or perhaps even any amount of electricity back to the grid – there have been some pricing changes, and selling back electricity may not make much financial sense in some states ( see: https://calmatters.org/environment/climate-change/2024/01/california-solar-demand-plummets/ )
4) batteries are not cheap, so unless there’s a good reason to get them (i.e. frequent power outages or an off-grid place) you may want to skip them, or get just enough for emergency lighting.
5) the tariffs may mess up pricing and financials somewhat, but aside from physical damage (i.e. major hail storm) there should not be too many equipment failures, and even 20 - 30% extra shouldn’t make that much of a difference in the long run.

JanJ

real_aurgathor
My Daughter in Oakland, CA last fall added battery backup and few more panels to her existing system. She says the new extra panels cover battery charging - battery covers most of night, so income from original system still continues with overall lower power bill. Say’s it’s very cost effective to recoup costs with tax incentives, and her area averages 90% of useable daylight with 0% obstruction.

I looked into it here (NC) but mountain & trees block angle toward sun. So no go here (at house), but local power company has Solar Farm in valley without obstruction, so we joined that. Almost break even, but profits buy more panels for second farm to reduce cost from who they buy from, so over time should break even or go positive. Time will tell!

iahawkeye83

JanJ If I ever get my own place I would put my money on a whole house standby generator. I have had enough power outages at my current place to justify the cost and having health issues and relying on medical equipment and needing refrigeration for medication. I would not spend the $10,000 to install a standby generator in a rental but I am gambling with my life. The sooner I can get my own house the sooner I can get a standby generator. The housing market is NOT in my favor right now. Not enough inventory, housing prices are out of control, and interest rates are sky high. There are down payment assistance programs where I live.

real_aurgathor

JanJ

I was thinking about getting some panels, but since:
1) I expect to move within a year or two
2) Have some partial tree cover
it probably won’t happen here; however, I expect to rely mostly on solar at my next place.

cypherstream

iahawkeye83 the housing market really isn’t in anyone’s favor… unless your selling.

Wish you luck!

real_aurgathor

iahawkeye83 a whole house standby generator. I

Whole house standby generators are a whole different ballgame. and personally, I wouldn’t bother with one. I would just get a regular generator that would need to be manually started and connected to loads/ Even in a rental you could get a portable generator since you can take it with you.

pandaman1784

iahawkeye83 The housing market is NOT in my favor right now. Not enough inventory, housing prices are out of control, and interest rates are sky high.

to be honest with you, short of another pandemic of calamity, the housing market will never be in a buyer’s favor again. a decade of low interest rates have locked in much of the housing market with super low interest rates. unless you REALLY have to sell, those folks are not likely to let go of those mortgages. i’m one of those people. i will most likely pay off the mortgage after 30 years than to sell. heck, i rather hold the home and rent it out. breaking even in terms of rental income is better than selling at this point. my home is printing me money just by the fact that i have a low interest mortgage.

second, governments are wary of weak stock markets and weak housing markets. they will immediately jump in with some sort of financial support if they see a wobble in the market. as such, you won’t see much selling price decreased.

with both of these factors, you’re constantly going to be lots of buyers chasing low, expensive inventory. the only real solution is to build a crap ton of new homes. but most of the desirable areas are already taken. the next step is to further increase densities of cities. but i personally love a single family home.