Study: 71% of US Households Get Their Router & Gateway From Their ISP

Donawalt

Challenge to the future of COAMs? Hope not..

https://cordcuttersnews.com/study-71-of-us-households-get-their-router-gateway-from-their-isp/

Dks01

Donawalt And? When I install 3Gb symmetrical fibre, my ISP moved me to an integrated hub with a built in ONT, making instillations easier and less complex. They also are using XGS-PON. The hub does not have a bridge mode but PPPoE pass through. I have no need to sped $500 on additional equipment just to have my own router when the supplied hub works perfectly well. I do have a 10Gb unmanaged switch to feed several computer from the hub. I also have 5 Plume pods from my ISP that integrate with the modem/hub perfectly. The whole thing just works.

ElQuintron

This saddens me a great deal.

CrashMan

Most people nowadays want a plug-n-play solution without fiddly third party gear. If you are using the provider’s modem or gateway, the responsibility for maintaining that is on the provider. It’s part of the price of service. You are usually not going to get a discount for using your store bought router.

HELLFIRE

“I’m not [insert here] , I just want the f**king thing to WORK!” Tale as old as time…

Regards

Astyanax

HELLFIRE “I’m not [insert here] , I just want the f**king thing to WORK!” Tale as old as time…

This. People value their time doing other things. Figuring out router configs is tantamount to mowing the lawn to some.

neel

The reality is:

Most people are idiots, their ISP router is the turnkey solution
Router vendors know us geeks are more profitable, we’ll spend more money on better equipment but idiots don’t know specs. I’ve had family members say a MikroTik Wi-Fi 6 is “faster” than a UniFi Wi-Fi 7.
While idiots used third-party routers to save money, we spend more to use a third-party router: look at AT&T bypass threads on 8311, we’ll pay more to not have an AT&T gateway. Or unlocked GL.iNet which lets you clone a T-Mobile/Verizon 5G router.
Even if a typical person is willing to buy a router, their ISP might include free Wi-Fi so they won’t bother
While average people turned to ISP routers, geeks are buying UniFi and MikroTik and OPNsense boxes. I have MikroTik wAPs and CCRs and CRSs which cost me $1200+. That’s like 10 years of an ISP router rental.

It’s just that third-party routers are becoming a geek’s product instead of a mass-market product. High-end DIY and gaming PCs are still a big business when most high-end computer buyers buy Macs. But for some applications like gaming Macs are ill-suited. What we do is likewise ill-suited for ISP routers.

A better analogy is sports cars: Corvette and Porsche enthusiasts spend tons of money on their cars, and sure, a Toyota Camry is more reliable, but a sports car is always going to be more fun if you’re a car enthusiast. But if you’re not, a Porsche is a nightmare because most people want a low-maintenance car.

Donawalt

Yes neel you said it pretty well.I wouldn’t call the 70% idiots, I do think they have a different motivation. Networks are an appliance, like a dishwasher. Plug it in and use it. That’s perfectly fine imho. But it’s not me.

I think I will always want to spend some more and get top quality - service, speed, elegance of technology solution. Technology is my field, so it’s imperative not to have some ISP’s closed solution that I can’t examine, learn from, tune, investigate, etc. etc. I take pride that the network here “just works”. For that I am willing to pay for my own equipment and solution.

urbanriot

neel

The reality is:

You missed a reality:

Many ISPs don’t give their end-users a choice, you have to use their provided device unless you want a double-NAT scenario.

mmmdonuts

neel
In real life even the most knowledgeable and professionals have other things where they’d prefer to spend their time and money. If the ISP’s CPE is the right tool for the job there’s no need to change it. If it isn’t then they know to fix that and it’s a done deal. Many share what they change and how so that others can benefit. Tinkering is optional. Spending extra time and money is a choice. That others choose not to doesn’t make them idiots.

neel

Donawalt This is true. I just used “idiots” as “people who don’t care about networking.”

With cars, people splurge because it’s an item which can be shown off. Look at Land Rover, they make terrible cars yet people buy them because a Range Rover gives oohs and ahhs. Range Rovers are a status symbol.

Or Apple products: while Macs are reliable (unlike Range Rovers) people buy MacBooks because it has more brand value than other laptops. It makes you look “cool” in a coffee shop or lecture room.

With networks, it usually stays hidden so most people don’t care. An ISP router could be made by Huawei and people will still rent it. My family has no clue who MikroTik is very less the fact that MT powers our Wi-Fi.

But there are places where I might be an “idiot.” I don’t know about food items, I just stick with what I know despite family telling me I should care while my brother is a huge cook. His hobby is cooking the way mine is networking.

Donawalt

Oh yes neel I am an “idiot” with a lot of things! Just not technology lol.

egeezer

neel This is true. I just used “idiots” as “people who don’t care about networking.”

There are very valid reasons why people use default service provider setups.
One, simplicity. No having to learn networking to set up routers, configure VLANs on a managed switch, monitor for and schedule firmware upgrades and more. All the functions they need are handled for them.

Two, if the hardware craps out or becomes obsolete, the provider replaces it and provides support for installation.
Three, if my much older relative has problems with no internet conection, I don’t have to drive up to troubleshoot it 😃
That being said, I prefer having my own networking setup because my requirements make a default hardware and networking configuration necessary.

Using the term “idiots” for those not interested in networking is not unlike using the same term for those not interested in Shakespearean plays, diesel mechanics, clock repair, needleworking or jewelry making. Each to his own skills and interests. 🙂

Donut417

Only reason we have our own modem and router is because Comcast charges $15 to $25 a month (depending of if you have unlimited data or not) for their gateways. Plus historically ISP supplied equipment has sucked, though I have heard the stuff now days gets the job done.

HELLFIRE

Astyanax Figuring out router configs is tantamount to mowing the lawn to some.

mmmdonuts In real life even the most knowledgeable and professionals have other things where they’d prefer to spend their time and money.

I may be a [insert profession here], doesn’t mean I like taking my work home with me when I clock out…

shrugs

Regards

Donut417

urbanriot Many ISPs don’t give their end-users a choice, you have to use their provided device unless you want a double-NAT scenario.

Not true. Cable providers have to allow customer owned equipment. But that being said, most providers support bridge mode or IP Pass thru mode, which takes care of the double NAT issue. The only providers you really have to worry about Double NAT is going to be ones using Carrier Grade NAT.

urbanriot

Many ISPs don’t give their end-users a choice, you have to use their provided device unless you want a double-NAT scenario.

Donut417

Not true

Wrong.

But I guess you don’t realize that people are posting here from other countries or other states, and don’t realize that some people have mixed services which won’t function without the ISP provided modem. AT&T fiber in certain states, for example, won’t provide support if you’re not using their modem. You can easily fact check that on Reddit.

real_aurgathor

Verizon, and later Frontier would give you a ‘free’ DSL modem (Verizon), them later DSL modem/router/WiFi combo (Frontier), so there was little reason to use something else, although I was using the modem provided by Verizon with my Frontier service. I don’t think they charged for the CPE equipment separately.

Comcast can sell or rent a gateway, but subscribers are free to use their own. Now, renting is usually stupid unless it’s for a very short period, especially since used cable modems can be had for next to nothing. My first cable modem was $7.99 from Goodwill, and worked for about 3 - 4 years when it stopped working. The replacement was $15 – someone upgraded to a as Gigabit service, and his old modem was not fast enough for that.

Donut417

urbanriot T&T fiber in certain states, for example, won’t provide support if you’re not using their modem. You can easily fact check that on Reddit.

I specifically said Cable providers, not Fiber Providers. Which matters. Because the FCC states Cable providers have to allow customer owned equipment. Also I dont use Reddit.

Astyanax

I would imagine this is the typical interaction between a customer and an ISP tech:

HELLFIRE

Astyanax I would imagine this is the typical interaction between a customer and an ISP tech:

…or some variation of “[insert here] is broken / happens at random times, FIX YOUR S**T!” AFTER passing through several other helpdesks that do NOTHING but transfer the ticket to someone else to make their metrics better 🙄 🙄 🙄

/PTSD triggered

Regards